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	<title>ETF2L &#8211; Latest activity in &#8220;Season 4 Division Groups&#8221;</title>
	<link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/support/topic-988/</link>
	<description><![CDATA[The latest posts to this topic.]]></description>
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    	    <title>Reply by deus</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/support/topic-988/page-2/?recent=16393#post=16393</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[LOL more balanced? well as I always appreciate the hard work of the admins I would hardly call it balanced. btw just fyi I'm not talking bout my clan I'm hapy we are div3 to start and any new formed clan should start there even when they think there div2.

but recently when we started to play matches there are some or even alot of players in div2 who should of been replaced with a div 3 team easy. so the so called balance is not really around. 

On second note I agree with the first dude why not make div3B lower then div3A for example]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Sun, 11 Jan 2009 08:34:53 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by Sonofpi3</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/support/topic-988/page-2/?recent=16393#post=14620</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[no that was how the old tfc scene used to work it was just based in UK eg the UKTFCL]]></description>
    	    <guid isPermaLink="false">generator=rsdiscuss&#038;baseurl=https://staging.etf2l.org&#038;feed=forum&#038;forum=support&#038;topic=988&#038;post=14620</guid>
    	    <pubDate>Sat, 03 Jan 2009 21:19:38 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by Gheedz</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/support/topic-988/page-2/?recent=16393#post=12583</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[Stimpack, yes it could be a solution, but us for example, our results on our site mix the results of the two lineups, so they're kind of... bad :p]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Wed, 17 Dec 2008 23:24:56 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by xtala</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/support/topic-988/page-2/?recent=16393#post=12512</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[gheedz: There are very few countries who actually have a league for teams from that countrly only.]]></description>
    	    <guid isPermaLink="false">generator=rsdiscuss&#038;baseurl=https://staging.etf2l.org&#038;feed=forum&#038;forum=support&#038;topic=988&#038;post=12512</guid>
    	    <pubDate>Wed, 17 Dec 2008 16:18:02 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by Wookie</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/support/topic-988/page-1/?recent=16393#post=12458</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[Or just look results of new team who set their skill level to 3 or more.]]></description>
    	    <guid isPermaLink="false">generator=rsdiscuss&#038;baseurl=https://staging.etf2l.org&#038;feed=forum&#038;forum=support&#038;topic=988&#038;post=12458</guid>
    	    <pubDate>Wed, 17 Dec 2008 13:00:54 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by Gheedz</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/support/topic-988/page-1/?recent=16393#post=12448</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[I think the best way is to look at national ligues (In France, www.lftf2.net), you can see approximatively the level between french teams here. Is not exact, because some top teams dropped (redLine, expansion, pancake), but it was pretty balanced on season 5.
If you do the same to other countries by looking tables of score it will help you ;)]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Wed, 17 Dec 2008 11:32:09 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by JvanW</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/support/topic-988/page-1/?recent=16393#post=9648</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[We had the same problems in the 2nd season. The first season was pretty good organised. But we just had 3 or 4 Divisions. Now it is around 20 - 25. A big difference.

In season 2 we were  dropped in Division 3. And we lost each match with the max you can make in matches. Thats realy no fun for each clan. That was one of the reasons we didnt played season 3.
Now i see that the divisions are a bit more balanced. But you can pick out the competitive clans in the lower divisions who are new.

The gap between fun clans and clans who wants to be competitive are too big.

Maybe its an idea to put in the clan details if you are a funclan or a competitive clan.
I know you admins are doing your best. And its not easy to run a big league as this one. But for the funclans, the fun part is flowing away for them.]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Fri, 14 Nov 2008 17:15:56 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by tenshox</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/support/topic-988/page-1/?recent=16393#post=8940</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[Please lock the roster after the season has started, thx.]]></description>
    	    <guid isPermaLink="false">generator=rsdiscuss&#038;baseurl=https://staging.etf2l.org&#038;feed=forum&#038;forum=support&#038;topic=988&#038;post=8940</guid>
    	    <pubDate>Wed, 05 Nov 2008 16:08:36 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by Netsky</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/support/topic-988/page-1/?recent=16393#post=8742</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[http://etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-1065/?recent=8654

just wait for an official news, which should be published soon]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Tue, 04 Nov 2008 09:46:42 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by DeGodvader</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/support/topic-988/page-1/?recent=16393#post=8738</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[When is season 4 gonna start anyways?]]></description>
    	    <guid isPermaLink="false">generator=rsdiscuss&#038;baseurl=https://staging.etf2l.org&#038;feed=forum&#038;forum=support&#038;topic=988&#038;post=8738</guid>
    	    <pubDate>Tue, 04 Nov 2008 09:29:05 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by Black_Bob</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/support/topic-988/page-1/?recent=16393#post=8319</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[Yep must say with the how good is your clan rating system, I thought I was being honest saying we were 4/5 which was pretty low skill in my eyes since we were all good players but not that good on strategy (now corrected we know were horrific!) But everyone in group 4a all were very sharp opponets and all used tried and tested stratergies.

Maybe the diffrence between level 4 - 5 should of been made a little clearer due to the fact its where the majoity of clans go and there a massive jump in skill between the two divisons.

Level 5 for clans who are up for a fight and laught (-=Crazy=-)
Level 4 for clans who have drilled practice in every inch of getting to the center of pro gran as a team within 15 seconds!

Sorry for my weird and wonderfull ramblings of a nub whos has his ego well and truly stomped (but learnt a load thanks all those peeps in div 4a)]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Wed, 29 Oct 2008 23:24:58 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by Sonofpi3</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/support/topic-988/page-1/?recent=16393#post=7952</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[to be honest i think we should do it the way that the old TFC uk league was ran 
http://uktfcl.far2cool.com/leaguetable.aspx
or
http://uktfcl.far2cool.com/leaguetable.aspx
any new signed up team plays a team from each division then if they win they go up to the next division say ....
ie. we are div 5 if they beat us they would play someone from div 4 if they lost to them they should be placed in high div 5 or low div four. because to be honest no one in the league is honest when it comes to skilling your own clan as we have BoS and Yourip extrim who are both easily div 4 maybe div 3 clans in 5a and they rated themselves one.
im really looking forward to season 4 and hope everyone does well..
gl hf 

SonOfPi3]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Sun, 26 Oct 2008 18:29:17 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by dAyKiLLeR</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/support/topic-988/page-1/?recent=16393#post=7824</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[@Moobie: About 10 admins discussed Season 3 seedings + we had a pre-announcement of Divisions where teams had some days time to request another Division. Imo we did a good job in Season 3 Seedings (from the point they were done). Ofc a lot changes in between 3 months.

@Kloppy: I can't tell you by now, as it's not even sure when Season 4 is gonna start. But you won't be placed in the same Division with same teams, it will be mixed up again (+ probably more changes, but can't say anything to that atm).]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Fri, 24 Oct 2008 18:44:27 +0200</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by Netsky</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/support/topic-988/page-1/?recent=16393#post=7820</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[*flame* :)

no sometimes you really don't know how a team will play during the following season. Ok you may be right about doing that kind of research but is a guarantee that the divisions will be equal? Surely not. As I saw for season3 there was quite some work done on seeding the teams but if you never saw a team before, where would you class it? Of course last division, but what if this team has got some great players you never heard of, and god-like team play? 
We didn't introduce that skill-level on sign-up just for fun. If each team is honest by ranking them selves, it will take away a lot of work.

Furthermore the admin stuff got doubled some time ago. So no need for more at the moment.]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Fri, 24 Oct 2008 18:26:12 +0200</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by MooBie</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/support/topic-988/page-1/?recent=16393#post=7774</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[I would say there were many instances in this currant season where I looked at divisions and wondered what the thinking was behind them with some seedings. You seem to have based a fair few of your seedings going on ETF2L only. There have been many clans I have looked at there homepages and checked up on other league sites they have played in and there league placements honestly just baffled me.

What I'm basically saying is I personally feel more effort could have been put into the background checks of clans just going on some of the divisions (oooo this will get some admin flame). Dont just check results and previous seasons placings, but also events in the clan (large member changes) and if in doubt go and speak to clan personally!

I do appreciate its a lot of work doing this and I know myself how much work seedings teams for events can actually be from past experiance. But if you are running a league its you that are responsible for making sure every team in it is enjoying there gaming on a fair playing field. If the job is too big recruit more admins! ;)

Please dont take what I've said as a dircet insult, far from it! I think you guys in ETF2L do an excellent job for the TF2 community I just think tho that this is one area that you could be stronger on. Its something that all of the league sites have a problem with atm and its damaging the lower end of the TF2 community, those clans that only play for fun but even then can only take so much hammering]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Fri, 24 Oct 2008 02:13:41 +0200</pubDate>
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