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	<title>ETF2L &#8211; Latest activity in &#8220;Players vs. admins&#8221;</title>
	<link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-6530/</link>
	<description><![CDATA[The latest posts to this topic.]]></description>
    	<item>
    	    <title>Reply by dAyKiLLeR</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-6530/page-2/?recent=98990#post=98990</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[I liked the way people discussed in here... for the first 45 minutes.

Before it comes to another 10+ pages thread full of flame and spam, I will have to lock this.]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Sun, 20 Sep 2009 01:12:10 +0200</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by aeqvist</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-6530/page-1/?recent=98990#post=98988</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[<blockquote>AC admins sux ass , especially winneh (he's really pro anti-cheat xD). And those  who sux admin's dick , without analyse the situation makes me laugh</blockquote>

Like a BloW-job you mean?]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Sun, 20 Sep 2009 01:08:57 +0200</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by D2M</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-6530/page-1/?recent=98990#post=98987</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[<blockquote>
yeah I actually suggested that about 2-3-4months ago, but it seems i'm only admin that likes that idea. After I saw that I quickly tried to get every admin to read that and made topic in admin forums about that and asked opinions - just to quickly notice that once again im alone with this matter.</blockquote>

-17:29:57- (@D2M) m0re - i support the idea btw
-17:29:58- (@D2M) ;x]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Sun, 20 Sep 2009 01:08:56 +0200</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by fJack</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-6530/page-1/?recent=98990#post=98986</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[thought you were going to suggest a friendly players vs. admins game :/]]></description>
    	    <guid isPermaLink="false">generator=rsdiscuss&#038;baseurl=https://staging.etf2l.org&#038;feed=forum&#038;forum=league&#038;topic=6530&#038;post=98986</guid>
    	    <pubDate>Sun, 20 Sep 2009 01:08:49 +0200</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by adam-skyride</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-6530/page-1/?recent=98990#post=98984</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[<blockquote>AC admins sux ass , especially winneh (he's really pro anti-cheat xD). And those  who sux admin's dick , without analyse the situation makes me laugh</blockquote>

French people who sux, use hacks and can't english make me laugh]]></description>
    	    <guid isPermaLink="false">generator=rsdiscuss&#038;baseurl=https://staging.etf2l.org&#038;feed=forum&#038;forum=league&#038;topic=6530&#038;post=98984</guid>
    	    <pubDate>Sun, 20 Sep 2009 01:05:45 +0200</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by BloW</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-6530/page-1/?recent=98990#post=98982</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[AC admins sux ass , especially winneh (he's really pro anti-cheat xD). And those  who sux admin's dick , without analyse the situation makes me laugh]]></description>
    	    <guid isPermaLink="false">generator=rsdiscuss&#038;baseurl=https://staging.etf2l.org&#038;feed=forum&#038;forum=league&#038;topic=6530&#038;post=98982</guid>
    	    <pubDate>Sun, 20 Sep 2009 00:54:02 +0200</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by adam-skyride</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-6530/page-1/?recent=98990#post=98981</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[I agree,

However I think its quite obvious what the solution is. Im not going to state what it is because lets be honest, everybody here knows what it is and its not going to happen...]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Sun, 20 Sep 2009 00:53:52 +0200</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by Minimoose</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-6530/page-1/?recent=98990#post=98980</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[That thread needed to be locked, no one would see Jimmy's post in the middle of all the spam. I think Jimmy's idea is great but also you have to look at this realistically, the season is supposed to start soon and you can't expect the small admin team to re-organise everything when they volunteer to do this anyway. I'm sure they have lives to lead.

Gryzor already admitted that Jimmy's idea was good and might be considered, but it's too late for this season.

m0re - if the majority of the player base like the idea then surely the admin team might reconsider? Although how you would get data on this is beyond me because people would probably start creating fake accounts if a vote was initiated and turn it into another fiasco like the FaN (I wanted it limited :D)]]></description>
    	    <guid isPermaLink="false">generator=rsdiscuss&#038;baseurl=https://staging.etf2l.org&#038;feed=forum&#038;forum=league&#038;topic=6530&#038;post=98980</guid>
    	    <pubDate>Sun, 20 Sep 2009 00:53:46 +0200</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by m0re</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-6530/page-1/?recent=98990#post=98979</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[<blockquote>
 Jimmy's idea is awesome and I think m0re mentioned that some time ago, too bad we won't see that in action yet.

edit: Jimmy's message: http://etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-5616/page-8/?recent=98824#post-98770</blockquote>

yeah I actually suggested that about 2-3-4months ago, but it seems i'm only admin that likes that idea. After I saw that I quickly tried to get every admin to read that and made topic in admin forums about that and asked opinions - just to quickly notice that once again im alone with this matter.]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Sun, 20 Sep 2009 00:53:40 +0200</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by oblivion</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-6530/page-1/?recent=98990#post=98977</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[I have to agree, it seems odd to me that considering the TF2 community as a whole is so much nicer than in other games (its not constantly people calling others hackers etc), that the etf2l community can't actually have a serious discussion without someone starting a flame war (intentionally or not).

If we could have a proper discussion without making it personal, maybe JB's idea would actually be implemented next season and not just ignored...]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Sun, 20 Sep 2009 00:49:21 +0200</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by vlad_drac</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-6530/page-1/?recent=98990#post=98976</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[<blockquote>I'm sorry but the one admin to close the thread containing the best fucking idea about division placements just HAD to be Gryzor.

No offence to anyone but come on...</blockquote>

<blockquote>The whine is just people who fail to see what a huge amount of work seeding teams is and that it isn't really possible to satisfy everyone. Try folding+reforming less people, would make everyone's life a lot easier.</blockquote>

Both of those quotes make me sadface :P  The first quote misses the point entirely, and the second quote - I don't think you understand what i mean.  Perhaps it's a bit deep for these forums :P

Some people complain about stuff like the seedings, and in a way they have a point.  The admins may have made some mistakes because they're human and that's what we do.  They complain and the admins stonewall the complaints instead of listening because they see it as "pointless wajn".  And they have a point too, because a lot of it is pointless whine and mindless insults which they're sick of reading.

At some point the lines get crossed, and the people who have something valid to say/complain about are ignored as pointless whiners.  Then those people feel angered because they're ignored and start lashing out at the admins, so the admins lash back.

Then someone cuts the crap and suggests something and it makes you think that there's probably a lot more good ideas out there if only both sides weren't ignoring each other.  Like i say, could be bullshit, and mabye it's a bit too much of a rose-tinted naive view to actually expect everyone to get along for their own mutual benefit :P

Vlad drac: peace maker.  You never saw it coming from my tfc days.]]></description>
    	    <guid isPermaLink="false">generator=rsdiscuss&#038;baseurl=https://staging.etf2l.org&#038;feed=forum&#038;forum=league&#038;topic=6530&#038;post=98976</guid>
    	    <pubDate>Sun, 20 Sep 2009 00:43:47 +0200</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by seggz</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-6530/page-1/?recent=98990#post=98974</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[would be easier if you would acctualy mention jb's idea,for the ignorant ones of us.]]></description>
    	    <guid isPermaLink="false">generator=rsdiscuss&#038;baseurl=https://staging.etf2l.org&#038;feed=forum&#038;forum=league&#038;topic=6530&#038;post=98974</guid>
    	    <pubDate>Sun, 20 Sep 2009 00:39:57 +0200</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by Sturmis</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-6530/page-1/?recent=98990#post=98970</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[<blockquote>I'm sorry but the one admin to close the thread containing the best fucking idea about division placements just HAD to be Gryzor.

No offence to anyone but come on...</blockquote>

Leave Gryzor alone already, he said JB's idea was worth thinking about, and made it clear it couldn't be done for s6...

I don't think most people really hate the admins, at least I hope they don't. The admins are doing a great job for free so that all the hundreds of teams can enjoy playing in etf2l. The whine is just people who fail to see what a huge amount of work seeding teams is and that it isn't really possible to satisfy everyone. Try folding+reforming less people, would make everyone's life a lot easier.

Jimmy's idea is awesome and I think m0re mentioned that some time ago, too bad we won't see that in action yet.

edit: Jimmy's message: http://etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-5616/page-8/?recent=98824#post-98770]]></description>
    	    <guid isPermaLink="false">generator=rsdiscuss&#038;baseurl=https://staging.etf2l.org&#038;feed=forum&#038;forum=league&#038;topic=6530&#038;post=98970</guid>
    	    <pubDate>Sun, 20 Sep 2009 00:26:17 +0200</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by Ijantis</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-6530/page-1/?recent=98990#post=98968</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[I'm sorry but the one admin to close the thread containing the best fucking idea about division placements just HAD to be Gryzor.

No offence to anyone but come on...]]></description>
    	    <guid isPermaLink="false">generator=rsdiscuss&#038;baseurl=https://staging.etf2l.org&#038;feed=forum&#038;forum=league&#038;topic=6530&#038;post=98968</guid>
    	    <pubDate>Sun, 20 Sep 2009 00:19:43 +0200</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by zeKe</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-6530/page-1/?recent=98990#post=98967</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[lol hippy go hug a tree qq]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Sun, 20 Sep 2009 00:17:14 +0200</pubDate>
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