I would like to request this thread to be locked please, it has been hijacked and taken away from the initial point I was making which was about a voting system, now we have the same old shitstorm ragefest I was talking about cheers Swarlz

nobody was interested in your opinion there and nobody is interested in your opinion here

I realise I am getting trolled, but I don't think I have met someone who is so infuriatingly slow.

The arguments for unlocks: it adds new tactics that can be explored (Scottish Resistance on BL last/Buff banner (although that may be OP) and yes I just used a bracket inside a bracket (mindfuck)) some items add whole new dimensions to a class (Equaliser/FaN/Gunslinger) and make it competitively viable (Degreaser/Dentonator if it gets added/GRU if it was nerf a bit). Other weapons increase the skill ceiling of a class (Ambassador). Other are admitably are OP and those should be banned. Other are useless and will never see competitive play (Black Box), but some people may like to try them and might find something interesting to do with them, so they shuuld be allowed. Loved the article that Racio (I think) linked a while back interesting read, basically summing up the entire unlock argument rather well and offering an interesting view that TF2 is one of the few games were the 'pro' players have the same views as the scrubs in different games. Please link more interesting articles, not even on gaming in general, as I have basically given up on acedmic work, but love to read and argue, in general explore ideas anything I get that is interesting is good. Also people should go read Freakonmoics and the squeal, which I am reading atm, just about to finish it. P.P.S I have swung about two or three times between Vanilla and unlocks, people are presenting good arguments on either side. At the moment I am in between, I think Vanilla is easier to implement across leagues and LAN's but unlocks can provide a new dimension to the game that I do enjoy seeing and using.

I think we should just allow all unlocks. This would be the only way to show opponents of vanilla just how great it would be.

[...] fuck you.

[...] I understand that xzar might be a cunt to to you and all, but if you seriously think this game works that way. Go and l2p!. I mean that is like saying quake revolves around the same tactics, because it doesn't have unlocks to change them or even better Football games have the same tactic every time, because it's the same map, the same rules, the same abilitys every round. There are literaly like 3 or 4 unlocks(besides the medic) anyway, that actully change this game and make it deeper/tactical, while not making it annoying and game breaking for the other players.

[...] Not the game itself but the desire to play it competitively. I can't see how vanilla tf2 is fun, mainly because it revolves around the same strategies..

[...] Because NA players have nothing to do with ETF2L. As a admin of ETF2L I trust you understand that ETF2L stands for European Team Fortress 2 League

[...] How would the game die if vanilla stays? I can honestly say you're the first guy saying Vanilla isn't fun to watch (what does it has to do with anything lol) and how exactly it won't bring any new players ( was that ever the GOAL of vanilla? :D )