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	<title>ETF2L &#8211; Latest activity in &#8220;Survey on s9 maps&#8221;</title>
	<link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-15576/</link>
	<description><![CDATA[The latest posts to this topic.]]></description>
    	<item>
    	    <title>Reply by Spike Himself</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-15576/page-8/?recent=278066#post=278066</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[<i>Quoted from konr</i>
		<blockquote>[...]Oh no not people that disagree with eachother! It's a part of every discussion and it wouldn't even need to be had if people didn't.
I say discuss.</blockquote>

When it comes to unlocks, a forum disussion is nothing short of a complete waste of time and effort. We've seen dozens and nothing good ever came of it. They all end up in arguments.
Besides, this community is all about "talk, not act", so it's not like anything would ever actually get done anyway.]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Wed, 16 Feb 2011 11:17:37 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by KrimsonAer</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-15576/page-8/?recent=278066#post=277170</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[<i>Quoted from Яyan</i>
		<blockquote>[...]
Discussion rarely works without devolving into petty banter between parties.</blockquote>

No you rarely work without devolving into petty banter!]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Sun, 13 Feb 2011 11:03:43 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by Grimm</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-15576/page-8/?recent=278066#post=277138</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[<i>Quoted from konr</i>
		<blockquote>[...]Oh no not people that disagree with eachother! It's a part of every discussion and it wouldn't even need to be had if people didn't.
I say discuss.</blockquote>

Polls let people share an opinion without reprocussions of possibly arguing with some dickhead with no sense of reason.

Discussion rarely works without devolving into petty banter between parties.]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Sun, 13 Feb 2011 02:08:05 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by konr</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-15576/page-8/?recent=278066#post=276791</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[<i>Quoted from Spike Himself</i>
		<blockquote>[...]

You don't visit the forums often, do you? :P</blockquote>Oh no not people that disagree with eachother! It's a part of every discussion and it wouldn't even need to be had if people didn't.
I say discuss.]]></description>
    	    <guid isPermaLink="false">generator=rsdiscuss&#038;baseurl=https://staging.etf2l.org&#038;feed=forum&#038;forum=league&#038;topic=15576&#038;post=276791</guid>
    	    <pubDate>Sat, 12 Feb 2011 07:25:27 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by Severyo</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-15576/page-8/?recent=278066#post=276664</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[I don't think a consensus regarding unlocks will ever be found, the only way the unlock argument will end is if admins decide that they've had enough of the issue and just decide amongst themselves which to ban and stick with that even if the forums argue.]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Fri, 11 Feb 2011 19:00:19 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by Spike Himself</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-15576/page-8/?recent=278066#post=276662</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[<i>Quoted from Vince</i>
		<blockquote>While a poll could give you an idea, I do believe a discussion would be more worthwhile than a poll on this.</blockquote>

You don't visit the forums often, do you? :P]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Fri, 11 Feb 2011 18:51:22 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by h3r1n6</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-15576/page-8/?recent=278066#post=276661</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[I see, and it makes sense to get a general consensus on the system how to handle unlocks, before tackling the individual unlocks.

Vanilla+med
Various forms of selecting which unlocks to allow
Various forms of selecting which unlocks to ban
All unlocks allowed

While a poll could give you an idea, I do believe a discussion would be more worthwhile than a poll on this.]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Fri, 11 Feb 2011 18:39:08 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by RaCio</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-15576/page-7/?recent=278066#post=276653</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[You could get a much better effect and actually interesting statistics if you'd just ask about peoples general opinion and view on unlocks as a whole.

Unless you want to end up with people voting to ban razorback like last time ofc.]]></description>
    	    <guid isPermaLink="false">generator=rsdiscuss&#038;baseurl=https://staging.etf2l.org&#038;feed=forum&#038;forum=league&#038;topic=15576&#038;post=276653</guid>
    	    <pubDate>Fri, 11 Feb 2011 17:57:16 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by h3r1n6</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-15576/page-7/?recent=278066#post=276651</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[So an unlock poll should ask the players for their class, which the map poll does as well.

The best thing I could see doable would be ask for each weapon to choose between:
-Allow
Disallow, because:
-Overpowered
-Makes game not fun/slows game down
-Other bad effect (specifiy?)

It'd be also possible to split the allow section into reasons, and maybe find more reasons that would warrant a ban on items. Of course the poll results must not be the be all end all of unlock rules, but it's a nice way to see where people stand on this.]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Fri, 11 Feb 2011 17:51:42 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by RaCio</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-15576/page-7/?recent=278066#post=276646</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[<i>Quoted from Spike Himself</i>
		<blockquote>[...]

Which is easily countered by asking "what class do you play?",  and then just present the stats per class.</blockquote>
Survey finds heavies like GRU. Scouts dislike TDH. Researchers shocked.

Seriously though, its not about polls being impossible. If you'd ask people if they like stickytraps Im sure you wont get useful results. If you want to get relevant results you'd need to do a poll on the stances and views people have on the game. For example if they want to ban weapons if they are not "fun", or just if they are overpowered.]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Fri, 11 Feb 2011 17:23:32 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by Koeitje</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-15576/page-7/?recent=278066#post=276643</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[If i'd poll the interest for unlocks I wouldn't do it by rating them 1-5 for worst to best. I would go about skill needed, fun to play with, fun to play against, fun to watch people use etc.

<i>Quoted from Enef</i>
		<blockquote>I think most people  judged turbine/turbine_pro based on its RULES it was played with (pro having 10 min rounds and winlimit 5; whereas the last time turbine was played in Etf2l it was played 30 mins infinite caps)rather than the maps quality.</blockquote>
Assumptions. Just less easy to prove invalid than Racio's.

And still, pro scored above normal.]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Fri, 11 Feb 2011 16:59:25 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by Enef</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-15576/page-7/?recent=278066#post=276627</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[I think most people  judged turbine/turbine_pro based on its RULES it was played with (pro having 10 min rounds and winlimit 5; whereas the last time turbine was played in Etf2l it was played 30 mins infinite caps)rather than the maps quality.]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Fri, 11 Feb 2011 15:54:14 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by chippy</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-15576/page-7/?recent=278066#post=276626</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[<i>Quoted from kuma</i>
		<blockquote>
2. 1mm ledge negating all splash damage on ground
</blockquote>]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Fri, 11 Feb 2011 15:50:38 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by kuma1</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-15576/page-7/?recent=278066#post=276616</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[survey should be the gayest shit in tf2:

1. dumb hats
2. 1mm ledge negating all splash damage on ground
3. soldiers who still tunnelvision the ground and smash face on mouse
4. heavy
5. chris

ban now]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Fri, 11 Feb 2011 15:18:03 +0100</pubDate>
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    	    <title>Reply by Spike Himself</title>
    	    <link>https://staging.etf2l.org/forum/league/topic-15576/page-7/?recent=278066#post=276614</link>
    	    <description><![CDATA[<i>Quoted from RaCio</i>
		<blockquote>for unlocks this would work to a lesser extent as soldiers have no incentive to vote for scout weapons, and so on.</blockquote>

Which is easily countered by asking "what class do you play?",  and then just present the stats per class.]]></description>
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    	    <pubDate>Fri, 11 Feb 2011 15:02:23 +0100</pubDate>
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